i just heard a rumor and trying to verify it.
a current jw just told us that the elder's are now a separate entity and that when brought into court hearings and they try to use the 'clergy confidentiality clause' that the wtbt$ backs off and says the elders are their own separate entity.. anyone heard anything like this?.
Sorry, lost some of my post somewhere in cyberspace.
There was a recent court case where Elders tried the 'Clergy confidentiality clause' so they wouldn't have to testify and BAM! Awake magazine was entered into evidence that JW's have no clergy class so could not use that clause.
Youtube video link talking about the case:
But then a friend of ours just told us about a letter that was sent out, basically throwing the Elders under the bus legal wise.
i just heard a rumor and trying to verify it.
a current jw just told us that the elder's are now a separate entity and that when brought into court hearings and they try to use the 'clergy confidentiality clause' that the wtbt$ backs off and says the elders are their own separate entity.. anyone heard anything like this?.
I just heard a rumor and trying to verify it. A current JW just told us that the Elder's are now a separate entity and that when brought into court hearings and they try to use the 'Clergy confidentiality clause' that the WTBT$ backs off and says the Elders are their own separate entity.
Anyone heard anything like this?
so, i finally decided to become a member and make my first post .
a bit about me:.
i've been lurking around the forum for quite some time (about 6 months i think).
Conscience class is what quite a few of us view ourselves, instead of the WTBT$ 'apostates' term. Because we have not apostatized from God or Jesus. You can Google 'Conscience class' or you can go to JWSTRUGGLE.com
if jesus is the exact representation of his heavenly father, and if "god is love", and if there is no greater love than to give up one's own life for others, then if jesus gave up his life for mankind as the greatest act of love ever performed, why would jehovah be more concerned about his own name being vindicated and his rule being proven to be superior to man's rule than preventing untold millions of innocent persons over thousands of years from suffering and dying horribly?.
wouldn't jehovah be just like his son, jesus, and choose to sacrifice his own name and reputation out of his great love for mankind rather than permit so much suffering for thousands of years?
why would the almighty creator of the universe care so much about being 'slandered' by a rebellious spirit creature that he would have to permit so much suffering for so long?
Larsinger58- Regarding your comment about Jesus being Michael the Archangel, don't want to start an arguement, but just want to share something with you that I found. Jesus cannot be an angel. Heb 1:13 [LBT] "And did God ever say to an angel, as he does to his son, 'Sit here beside me in honor until I crush all your enemies beneath your feet"?
if jesus is the exact representation of his heavenly father, and if "god is love", and if there is no greater love than to give up one's own life for others, then if jesus gave up his life for mankind as the greatest act of love ever performed, why would jehovah be more concerned about his own name being vindicated and his rule being proven to be superior to man's rule than preventing untold millions of innocent persons over thousands of years from suffering and dying horribly?.
wouldn't jehovah be just like his son, jesus, and choose to sacrifice his own name and reputation out of his great love for mankind rather than permit so much suffering for thousands of years?
why would the almighty creator of the universe care so much about being 'slandered' by a rebellious spirit creature that he would have to permit so much suffering for so long?
The biggest thing, Jesus paid the ransom, DONE.
IF there was an universal issue [God's RIGHT to rule] to be settled, there is nothing in the bible mentioning it. Satan wanted worship for himself, but he did not come out directly and challenge God's right to rule. Isa 14:14
If there had been a question about God's 'right to rule', then Satan would have totally ignored God's mandate not to kill Job. Just like we can reason out, that Satan had tried to kill Jesus from the moment he was born, but was not allowed to, until God's appointed time.
standing in for atlantis.
i post as [vulcan] with my daughter [petra] who helps as typist.
atlantis said that all of you would know about the download procedures.
Thank you Atlantis, Vulcan & Petra:
One thing that I noticed that wasn't mention above was the conclusion:
Jehovah wants you to be a member of his family of worshippers. You must obey the rules of the household.[1 Ti 3:14,15]
so, i finally decided to become a member and make my first post .
a bit about me:.
i've been lurking around the forum for quite some time (about 6 months i think).
Welcome Sparlock!
No need to hurry your exit. There are many that stay in and use their enlightenment to try and wake up the sleeping masses & family. Below is the link to a Youtube talk which is the FIRST recorded Conscience Class talk given in a KINGDOM HALL! That you might find interesting.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=giMZH_VJs1c
Perhaps you could do the same since you are an MS. Christ will use anyone & everyone that makes themselves available.
Welcome to the forum and peace on your journey. It will be difficult at times but hang in there, we're all in this together.
has article, page 32 which states about their 'neutrality' policy.
although our position as christian neutrals may not have been fully understood by our brothers nearly a century ago, they sought to please jehovah god.
this is aggravating, as the wts had 'policy' for so many years that jws could not do 'alternative' service.
I Had to laugh about this quote from pg 12:
ALWAYS DISPLAY QUALITIES THAT HONOR GOD 16 We also play a part in drawing people to Jehovah when we display such qualities as long-suffering, love, and kindness. Some who observe us may desire to learn about Jehovah, his purposes, and his people. The attitude and conduct of true Christians stand in sharp contrast with the mere outward show of godly devotion of those whose worship is often nomore than a hypocritical ploy. Some religious leaders have become wealthy by defrauding their flocks, using much of the money thus obtained to acquire expensive homes and automobiles —and in one case, an air-conditioned dog kennel. Indeed, many who claim to be followers of Christ have no inclination to 16. Why do such qualities as long-suffering, love, and kindness touch people’s hearts? Give an example. “give free.” (Matt. 10:8) Instead, like the wayward priests of ancient Israel, they “instruct just for a price”—and much of what they teach is unscriptural. (Mic. 3: 11) Such hypocritical conduct does not reconcile anyone to God.
i want to share with you an experience i had last night.
i was on my way to a vday date, hopped on the bus to get me there, and in front of me is a man folding tracts.
they say something about an end to suffering with a delusional paradise illustration.. so, he hands one to the woman in the row next to him, and tries to hand one back to me.
Awesome courage and intestinal fortitude. Sorry to hear about you family shunning you.
This is a horrible cult that ruins people's lives. I know because I'm pushing 50, NO education, and yes, we did have a janitorial business but not by choice we had to try and support ourselves.
I whole-heartedly agree with you because when I was about 12-14 I told my parents that I wanted to be a veternarian and they said 'No, the end is real close. You won't have time to finish so it will be a wate of time."
video if a meteorite crashing down in the urals:.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=90omh7_i8vi.
apparently 100's were injured.
NASA has some videos also:
